651/Drama-Packed Elliana Discussions

Drama-Packed Elliana Discussions
Date of Scene:	22 September 2014
Location:	Heaven or Hell Tower <HoH>
Synopsis:	You all should have seen this shit coming.
Cast of Characters:	168, 253

---

Psyber (253) has posed:
    The library. A quiet place of reflection and education. And today the site of what will probably a fairly ferocious debate between two people. But that's later, potentially, and not now.

    Right now, it's where Psyber is meeting Nathan. The half-angel has managed to drag a particularly unfancy table to the center of the library along with two chairs and a pitcher of water with two glasses. This looks more like a negotiation than a discussion, but then again most conversations between these two head that way.

    Psyber is sitting at one end of the table, calmly folding his hands and waiting for Nathan to be ready.

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    Nathan Hall takes his seat without much to mark this occasion. The guy's dressed and acting as he normally does: Blandly, with no emotions shown despite the rather intense situation of last night. He's already pouring himself a glass of water, though he's not going to be drinking it.

    Then, he clasps his hands under his chin, waiting to hear whatever it is that Psyber needs to talk to him about. He's at least taking this seriously, but whatever he's expecting, there's no indication of what he thinks is about to happen. "So." He says, simply. "You wished to speak with me?"

Psyber (253) has posed:
    Psyber seems pretty serious as he looks across the table at Nathan. He pours himself a glass of water, but lets it sit to the side while he contemplates how to open this. He starts with a quote from Nathan that the man probably did not expect Psyber to remember. While it was said as an Essence-filled whisper, Psyber delivers it in a pretty bland tone, "I have been hounding the cause of all this for /three years/. I have been stabbed by a friend, I have walked through the nightmares of gods, I have been betrayed left and right while I get talked down at every turn..."

    "You said that to General Steppenworth." Psyber notes, placing his hands flat on the table, "Is that your secret problem with Elliana, Nathan? The one you're so elusive about, I mean. You resent that I defend her? Do you believe I trust or like her more than you? I think it's time this one finally come out. I wanna know what's still eating at you after the last big blowout you had at her."

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    "The weight of my agenda, of my responsibility, needed to be conveyed. I have, as you recall, a substantial degree of hatred for Lady Fairchild as a result of forcing it upon me in the manner with which you are familiar. Not resentment for having to experience betrayal and pain, but resentment for having it brought to me such that I had to become something I am not meant to." Nathan says, his tone completely flat as he elaborates.

    "This is, I expect, well-known, and the more immediate cause of frustration. I certainly do not believe you trust her more than myself. Your defense of her is flawed, severely so, but less directly connected to my hatred for her. The posture I discussed facing in that last section of my statement is presented, somewhat, in that flaw, but I do not begrudge you for it." He gestures to himself here. "Given your expressed lack of desire to see my critique of it in the past, I am keeping it to myself, as seem to be the tactful thing to do. I also expect you rather do not wish to hear what is 'eating at me', as you say."

Psyber (253) has posed:
    "But you don't keep it to yourself. You may believe you act on some higher plane of social conduct, but I've known you long enough that I can see past the monotone and see past the flat expressions," Psyber says with a pretty stock-standard tone that might betray a hint of annoyance at the fringes, "Others may see you that way, but I've known you long enough to see you aren't devoid of emotion. The barely audible tone shifts, the posture, you might as well be snarling every time she comes up."

    "Even in this, you try to remain objective, but you tell me definitively that my defense of her is flawed. That you are justified and right in your views," Psyber leans back in his chair a bit, "You try to hide it behind rationality, but I know you. The more rational you phrase it, the less rational you actually are. You detach yourself more and more to avoid expressing an emotion that you feel may upset those around you." Red eyes narrow. When it's just him and Nathan, Psyber has no hesitation dropping his normal act.

    It's a Psyber few see, cold and calculated. The disarming mask of aloofness has been set aside, instead it's just a hunter. Someone trained to pick up on the smallest clues of everything around him. He says simply, "It's already bleeding into our work together, so why not just excise it now? It's better than the moments where you lose your perspective and bring my humanity into question for supporting her in any fashion."

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    Psyber's got Nathan's mannerisms nailed there. "The flaws in my stoicism are as you describe. I see little reason why this means they should be exacerbated more. My hatred of Elliana is rather under control, I believe. There are exacerbating factors within your defense. Should you particularly wish to know what they are," The librarian taps one finger against his clasped hands, the tiniest sign of a bit of agitation. "I can assure you that neither of us will be made happier for the experience."

    He shifts back in his chair, visibly making an attempt to settle himself. "And it has nothing to do with your humanity. I can assure you, I would certainly not hold such things against you." His dull, lifeless eyes are cast down for a moment, but come back up after a brief pause. "If I have to prove to you that not knowing is better, then I am certainly willing to be open, for so long as you acknowledge the nature of the exchange, the fact that neither of us will be better for it and you will find no convenient feelings of emotional closure from knowing."

Psyber (253) has posed:
    "Nathan, we're best friends. I wanna know what's bothering you so that I can at least have some sort of understanding," Psyber says firmly, "Right now, from my perspective, it looks like you want the world to believe Elliana is iredeemably dark and twisted with almost no good qualities or motivations."

    "Now if I'm wrong, you can correct me. I want your perspective on this matter, for whatever argument it is going to lead to," Psyber says, rubbing his palms on the desk out of mild anxiety. In pure conversation, Nathan definitely has the advantage here.

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    There's just the tiniest hint of narrowed eyes from Nathan. "Ignorance is certainly bliss. Well, then, in that case, I shall certainly provide an understanding, however much it will be regretted." He says, adjusting his glasses. He takes the glass of water he poured and stares down into it, as if there were something written in it.

    "But I will not do so in the manner of a cut-rate stage-play supporting character." His monotone remains unbroken. "You will find no rants or some sudden expulsion of pent-up emotion. Instead, I will attempt to guide you into understanding the nature of what I feel. Let me ask you a question. Let us imagine, for a moment, that you could, with no guilt, decide how I would handle the matter of Elliana Fairchild. In such a scenario, in such a situation where you could simply decide the optimal path, what would my actions /ideally/ be? What do you believe I should do?"

Psyber (253) has posed:
    "Guilt-free? If I had to, I would have you use your intellect to maneuver in such a way as to leave her placed in check. I wouldn't have you kill her, because I think she can still be saved, but I'd have to keep her checked so that I could continue the work I've been doing for years," Psyber says in a rather simple tone, humoring Nathan in this game for now. He wants to see why Nathan feels this way, and especially why Nathan would find Psyber cannot understand his thinking, as he's stated before.

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    "I do not mean what you would have me do now, in the state that I am." Nathan leans forward now, his shoulders somewhat tensed. "I mean what you would have me think of her. What opinion you /want/ me to have of her. What motives you wish for me to have, what particular actions you want me to cease in indulging due to my vendetta. What does the librarian, Nathan Hall, think, feel, and do, in your ideal, perfect world that you desire most and would work to achieve?"

Psyber (253) has posed:
    "Oh. Well in the ideal world, you'd think exactly the same way I do," Psyber says pretty casually, "That she's a 19 year old girl who had a fucked up childhood, made some decisions that she probably shouldn't have, was desperate for some measure of control over her life, and has some potential to be saved if people are willing to really work at it." He crosses his arms, "This is all the ideal, though. I know that I can't expect you to hold my views. I just don't see why you were willing to dive off a cliff to save Pegasus MAYBE, but are willing to make a pact with Eldritch Goddamn Monsters in order to kill Elliana."

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    There's no shift in posture, but Nathan apparently has a brief burst of difficulty holding his emotions back. Hairline cracks can be seen along the glass he holds. "Your mistake is the same mistake made by many, many others." He says, with a sudden drop to his tone. "Perhaps I should elucidate. Perhaps I should, /specifically/, refer back to Pegasus."

    Glancing to his water, he lifts his other hand and quickly snaps with it in an upward gesture. The glass's contents lift, slowly turning to a misty, soft white cloud that rises next to him. The purpose of this will be shown momentarily. For now, he speaks. "At no point did I ever believe, strongly, in the possibility of redeeming. Passively, certainly. I did not dedicate my rhetoric to it, though. I simply saw an opportunity and took it, after making sure I would always cultivate the opportunities and be present for them if I could."

    "Now, unless that small hint has provided an insight into this - and no, I am not asking you to keep your own defense of her /quiet/ - then," He gestures, bringing the small cloud to swirl up next to him. "I will elucidate the comprehensive truth of your flawed efforts to defend Lady Fairchild from me."

Psyber (253) has posed:
    "Please, Nathan. By all means, continue. We'll both swap opinions and see where this leads us," Psyber says, leaning back in his chair and switching to a more aloof sort of attitude as he waves his hand out in front of him. He watches the mist as it forms and cautiously looks towards Nathan.

    "Tell me the truth of my flawed efforts, as you've decided."

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    
    Nathan snaps again, harshly. Small bolts of lightning crackle along the surface of the cloud, lighting it up in ways that seem to show sharp relief in some kind of projected image. "The truth of your stance is that you believe I am more harmful to Lady Fairchild than yourself. You believe I would ever be able to try to kill her, and that I present some detriment to her."

    The memorized image on the cloud is one of Nathan, Psyber, and Elliana present in the volcanic chamber of the Lord of Rage. Psyber's blade blasts off waves of violent energy into Elliana, while Nathan kneels, venting power into her designs.

    "You believe I am, in some fashion, more damaging to Lady Fairchild, despite our history. Despite the fact that, at /every single possible turn/, I ensure that I provide as much possible opportunity for alliance and assistance as possible."

    The crackling lightning churns around the cloud, showing in sharp relief a memory of Nathan holding his wound, with a distraught expression, calling after Elliana while Psyber brandishes a gun at her.

    "You believe I have a more substantial history of harm to her, while the reality is that, with the exception of those incidents where she specifically seeks my opposition or those incidents where factional concerns absolutely demand our conflict, I have minimized the harm I present to her."

    The lingering bolts on the surface of the cloud show a memory of Nathan in Pegasus Pastries, one hand up to placate an aggressive-looking Nine and the other up to comfort an awkward-looking Elliana.

    "You believe that I intend, or ever intended, to kill her, or could even consider the idea. I have worked to negate and neutralize the silver bullets I held against her in the first place."

    Rapidly the images flicker with each bolt. Nathan at a negotiating table between the Imperials and the Stormcloaks. Nathan at Damcyan at Elliana's side. Nathan standing before Elliana at the mansion.

    "You believe I need to 'give her a chance', often telling me to cease my distrust of her, despite the fact that I work to do so as much as possible, even if occasion often means it is to my own detriment."

    The memories show Elliana slapping Psyber in his office lobby, flickering to the point where Nathan offers placating words to her from the sidelines.

    "You believe my stoicism is inadequate, that somehow I have actually intended to act on this hatred. I despise Lady Fairchild for reasons that you, in all your half-humanity, will never be able to comprehend. I do not /hurt/ her." The crackling electricity surges for a moment, illuminating Nathan's glasses and filling them with glare. "You can see my hatred, certainly. Have you tried seeing /any/ of my actions, Psyber? Or perhaps you become discomforted and cease any observation when evidence shows that you have hurt her far more than I ever have. Now do you see why I might find this /hypocritically offensive/?"

Psyber (253) has posed:
    Psyber takes a long, long moment to watch each and every memory. The half-angel's face is neutral despite the harsh images placed before him and he takes in each sight. Each image is infallibly a moment when he failed Elliana Fairchild. Did her harm in some fashion. The half-angel takes a deep breath, "My hypocrisy does not counter your own in this matter, Nathan. Yes, I've failed Elliana. But I've also succeeded for her numerous times."

    Psyber calmly folds his hands in front of himself, "You are correct that I have failed Elliana multiple times despite my stated goal of helping her. However, you are not better than I am."

    The half-angel takes out a pad of paper, flipping through dozens of pages before finding one at the very back and pulling the paper out. It compiles into a thick folder that Psyber opens in front of himself, "Let's rebutt."

    Psyber consults his note, "Did you or did you not tell Union-subordinate Kuklos ka Amalthea Schmendrick-Fortuna to pry at the memories of a projected six year old girl for the dying words of her mother? Would you say your reasoning behind this was to give Elliana Fairchild emotional closure on her mother's dying words? Many who were present believed your motive to be the acquisition of information you believed would give you advantage or leverage in the events of Terra Majora."

    "One of your memories is of me brandishing a gun at Elliana while you do nothing. Does this memory account for you being heavily wounded at the time?" Psyber inquires with a tilt of his head, looking across the table at Nathan, "Sorry I don't have fancy smoke or a selective eidetic memory."

    "Let's talk about the recorded incident of you beheading a man and giving his remains to Elliana? Was that to attempt to bridge your relationship, or was it a heavy handed show of your checkmate in opposition of her?" Psyber wonders, flipping to another page of the file.

    "It's true I've hurt her, but your memories omit that I have personally helped her countless of times more. I don't wish to turn this into a contest of who is a better friend to her, but let's be blunt. You interact with her or speak of her heavily over the radio. And while your actions may have a stoic intent, your words retain a level of hostility that masks or works against perceptions of you here, especially on my part."

    "And speaking of your words, let's discuss your mention of negating the silver bullets." Psyber says, moving to a different part of the folder.

Psyber (253) has posed:
    Psyber reaches into his folder and puts down a picture, "Luca Yurievna Vinakol. Age: One-Hundred Thousand and Thirteen, Race: Suspected Demon. Current goals are the collection and ressurection of non-categorized demonic entity known as Draupnir. Subject's choice of action: Roommates."

    Psyber flips through the folder some more and pulls out another picture. A familiar one from Nathan's memory flashes. He slaps it down in front of Nathan, "Biological Cyborg Entity Designation Nine. Age Unknown. Race: Cyborg. Current goals include attempting to resist cannibalistic urges, professional mental breakdowns, and serial murder. Subject's choice of action: Pacifistic. Best Friends."

    Psyber pulls out a third photo and drops it in front of Nathan. This time it's Hastur, "Subject's original recorded designation: Haita the Shepherd. Known Aliases: The Unspeakable One, Him Who Is Not to Be Named, Assatur, Xastur, H'aaztre, or Kaiwan. Layman's name: Hastur. Entity suspected to have been created shortly after generation of known universe. Believed to be responsible or contributive to multiple cults throughout history responsible for death, insanity or sacrifice. Current motivations: Undetermined. Subject's Choice of action: Devoted Follower."

    "Just three of your documented all-purpose Silver Bullets that I know about. You likely possess numerous others that I have yet to be able to ascertain," Psyber notes, waving a hand at the pictures in front of him, "This does not account for numerous other incidents stemming from your belief that her betrayals are targeted or centered around you, thus requiring your self-admitted continued escalation of power and risk in order to counter her. Now let's address some other people."

    Psyber pulls out another picture, "Himei Shoutan. Age 19. Alias: Pat Benatar. Occupation: Magical Girl, Student, World's Worst Pilot. A top-class Elite combatant frequently seen around Nathan Hall during Terra Majora incidents, Miss Shoutan possesses powers and combat prowess enough to put her on par with the Multiverse's strongest Elite Presence."

    Psyber drops another picture, "Kuklos ka Amalthea Schmendrick-Fortuna. Age 324. Occupation: Mother, Defender, Healer. A knight who, while frequently showing un-knightlike qualities, is still a high-tiered Elite presence. Also frequently seen in Nathan Hall's presence in a protective fashion."

    Psyber drops a final picture, "David Michael Sinclair. Known Alias: Psyber. Age 2024. Occupation as a paranormal investigator and professional problem solver. Subject has formed a symbiotic relationship of give and take with Nathan Hall wherein their mutual challenge of one another encourages a dual stabilization of disparate psychological urges. Frequently will protect Nathan Hall at all cost or injury. Nathan Hall is fully aware and, at times, dependant upon this relationship."

Psyber (253) has posed:
    Psyber places the closed folder down on the table, "You present me an image of a man who, while rude in words, is kind in actions and making every effort at restitution. You paint me as someone who hurts Elliana a great deal."

    Psyber looks at Nathan, "Have you considered that your ability to reliably take risks is bolstered by your trust in these individuals, and that without them you would likely find yourself feeling too insecure to take substantial self-risk due to your innately non-powerful nature?"

    "I apologize for misunderstanding your ultimate grasp of the situation, Nathan, and that is a failure on my part." Psyber has a 'but' here, "But with the evidence I have here, it may look like you're melting down your Silver Bullets, but at a glance it would appear you have so many you might just be doing it because you want a sword instead."

    "And on a more personal note, do you really think you've been better for her than I have?" He asks in a hurt tone, "Thanksgiving, the friendship, trying to give her someone outside the Feds to talk to. None of that weighed in?"

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    What Nathan Hall says next is said almost entirely without moving. "Not well conveyed by the image is the more recent attempt to beg her not to flee. The beheading incident, you will recall, was the rather tame response to the connected incident in which she knowingly lead me into an /explosive regicide trap/ when I trusted her, so perhaps we can consider that excused if we wish to discuss how worthy of trust she is."

    "As was meant to be demonstrated by the image, I specifically negated Nine and his initial intent to kill Lady Fairchild, going out of my way to negotiate with him some measure of protection from her. The same, you will recall, occurs for Luca, for whom I cite the assistance Lady Fairchild. Hastur, similar to Luca, has little motive and, I expect, less means than you believe to immediately bring lethal harm to Lady Fairchild, considering her Binding abilities. When I say silver bullet, I mean /silver/. Had I asked, I could have responded to betrayal with betrayal and had Nine murder her from within her own faction. At the ranks he achieved at the time, he would have suffered surprisingly little negative response."

    He tries not to let the "devoted follower" thing distract him.

    "Whatever efforts I make to amass a potential weapon against her are my own, and hold no moral bearing on what I am /doing/. You are correct, allies are all I have to provide me any measure of power. I fail to see the relevance this has to the fact that the actions I have taken up to this point are frequently made with her best interest, or at minimum her least harm, in mind. But you are quite correct."

    The only movement Nathan's made yet in this particular sequence of dialogue happens now, as he leans forward and narrows his eyes, the cloud dispersing with a snap of lightning. "I will assemble whatever means of addressing the threat Lady Fairchild poses that I deem necessary, because it is my responsibility. And should my pacifism and lack of desire for violence upon her person cease to interject, then you and Lady Fairchild will have nobody to blame but yourselves, for I have been /more/ than forgiving, /more/ than helpful, and far surpassed the obligations you, with all your angellic perspective, believe that there are to give her kind treatment."

    "You know me, better than most. You know what it takes to make me kill a fellow human being, or at least what fails to qualify. Does the blade matter?" His eyes are downcast now, for a moment. "If I ever strike her with it to true, proper effect, then she has ruined enough of who I am that I do not care if she would deserve it."

    There's a bit of an exasperated noise at the last of the questions. "I will not say, because I cannot say it /objectively/, whether or not you have been more help to her. Only Lady Fairchild knows. But your assistance to her is social. What I am simply trying to say is that I have been trying to help her, practically, a /great/ deal. Repeatedly, I have made this effort. And you act as though it is entirely invalidated by my hatred towards her, or my caution that perhaps someone who has betrayed me twice might be someone I would want to hurt one day. Perhaps you have helped her more, I cannot say what she regards as more important. But I /can/ say that I am extremely tired of being talked to as though I am not in control of my emotions. Or perhaps you will be satisfied if I simply, what, turn off all hatred towards her like operating some form of lightswitch?"

    "Perhaps it is worth it to cycle back around to our original question. With this in mind, Psyber: What more do you want me to do? I dedicate myself to helping her in the way I am able. You clearly want me to change something about it."

Psyber (253) has posed:
    Psyber slams a hand on the desk, "I'm not talking about your damn friends doing killing for you on the first three, Nathan. I'm talking about people giving you shit that you probably shouldn't be trusting in the first place and you accepting it. So don't feed me some line of crap about Hastur or Luca, because I know you could draw on either of those powers if you wanted. And at what cost of your allegiance? Aiding someone resurrecting dark forces? Servitude to an Eldritch being with motives that are, at times, shady as shit?"

    "And there's exactly your fucking problem. There's why you can't let anything go and why I have to talk down to you like you can't control your damn emotions," Psyber shouts, voice raising for the first time in the conversation, "'Because it is my responsibility', 'You will have no one to blame but yourselves'. Jesus Christ, Nathan. You are carving out pieces of yourself to respond to a threat MULTIPLE PEOPLE ARE DEALING WITH and still talking like she is your burden to bear. Holy shit, are you actually so self-centered and petty that you think that Elliana is your sole responsibility? That you have to respond to every escalation by selling some part of yourself to a greater power to counter it? Jesus, dude. You don't need to fix every problem she brings up. Stop being Staren."

    Psyber clenches his fist a bit and then releases it, "You are SO concerned with her ruining you that you can't see that you're ruining yourself. AND THAT IS WHY I TALK TO YOU THE WAY I DO," Psyber shouts across the table, "Because you are on a fucking SLOPE, whether you wanna admit it or not. And if I don't sit on the front lines, pushing you two apart any way I can, you will BOTH escalate." Psyber thrusts a finger to point at him, "Have you ever considered what your friends think about this? What it feels like every time you languish over every option in your pursuit of the perfect maneuver?"

    "You don't even SEE what I've done, Nathan," Psyber says, tapping his head, "I brought Mordred to heel. I took the TRAITOR KNIGHT and brought her back to honor and chivalry, or started her on that road. I SAVED YOUR GOAL'S LIFE yesterday with my 'social assistence', because big spoiler pal. I can take Mordred. I can take Elliana. I can maybe take Charity, we haven't fought. I can't take all three. If I hadn't talked her down, with my social assistance, he woulda died."

    "So no, Nathan. Let's spin this around." Psyber stands up abruptly, flipping the chair behind him over, "You clearly think I'm a hypocrite. That I can't handle this situation as well as you can. So you be me. Here."

    Psyber throws a pad of paper on the table, "Fetch Modus." He throws a ring of keys, "Office keys, all of them." He throws a gun on the table, "And my gun."

    "Be me. Tell me what I should be doing so that I'm not a hypocrite in your eyes. You tell me how to save the woman I-" A pause, "-look after."

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    "I do not believe she is my sole responsibility. But standing idly by, making no contributions to a problem I helped create and failed to stop, while other more capable people solve it for me, is not something that is morally acceptable. Certainly, others are addressing her problem. I would suffer more, knowing that I was not doing all that I can." Nathan says, simply. His voice isn't raising at all, he maintains the monotone absolutely.

    He looks at Psyber with one eyebrow going up dryly. He assumes his best 'I am being patient' posture and pushes the gun away slightly with one finger because it makes him uncomfortable.

    "Since you will not explain the disparity between your desires and my actions, fine, I will explain what you should do. Do what I do, for Pegasus, for Nine, and for any others." He pushes Psyber's inventory back towards him. "Stop /talking/ about saving her and /save/ her. That is, assuming you are unable to stop talking to me about how my stance regarding her is awful. I am acting in the highest moral capacity that I can, and with the highest respect for Lady Fairchild that I can, despite all of my feelings to the contrary. Should you find yourself able to cease the particular line of discussion where you apparently believe that that is inadequate, I will be quite satisfied with just that."

    He reclasps his hands, retaining his blank expression, his downcast eyes coming up again. "So yes, I am quite aware that I am complicit in self-ruination. I see little reason to defy my basic moral obligation just because my obligation to address my mistakes makes me suffer. However, I see little reason why my hatred towards her for what moral obligation continues to force me into is something that should be less justified, nor do I find a great deal of appreciation for your judgement of my hideous inadeqacies, angel. I made a mistake on a /cosmic scale/, and a librarian can only do so much. Am I supposed to simply and do nothing, allow sin to fester while my allies solve my problem and comfort me in the end about how I did everything I could? The betrayal of Elliana Fairchild is not all about me, no. But my part in it is bigger than I alone was able to address."

Psyber (253) has posed:
    "Is this really where this is going?" Psyber says to Nathan in a serious tone, "Are you emotionally detaching to the point where you identify me as a racial pronoun to avoid addressing the fact that watching you carve pieces out of yourself is incredibly devastating to me as a friend?" Psyber says, pressing in on the topic with Nathan.

    "You can't dictate or logic me into a concession on this topic, Nathan," Psyber says, tapping his finger on the table several times, "You don't have appreciation for me judging you in the capacity as an angel, but man..." He rubs his face a bit and looks at Nathan, "Doesn't the opinion of 'Psyber', your friend, matter at all here? Doesn't it affect you at all that it worries me the powers you're trying to garner?"

    Psyber starts picking up his inventory again and putting it back in his pockets or, for the gun, in its holster, "When did your view of me get so fucked up, Nathan? Am I this inadequate of a person to you?" He's definitely trying to, on some level, bring Nathan out of his disconnect into an objective words-production-mechanism and into a more human conversation.

    "For your hatred of her, and my disagreement, I've tried to respect you. And you have called me a hypocrite, demeaned the progress I've made. You didn't even have a response to the fact that it's my social efforts that are undermining her power bases and compromising her decisions with an ethical undertone." Psyber notes, "I can acknowledge your successes, but it feels like all you're doing is calling me a failure."

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    "You very much underestimate my capacity for dictating and logic." Nathan says, his flat expression taking a grim tint to it briefly. "You would prefer to watch me suffer because I sit by and do nothing while my sins fester? No. Psyber, do not presume to change the subject of this, it does not suit you."

    "You have /tried/ to respect me. You have failed. I did my best to respect the progress you made. As you will recall, I specifically made an effort to ensure that Lady Fairchild did not leave Heaven or Hell, so that it could be preserved. As I have said: Give attention to my actions. I held my tongue about matters such as these and informed you in no uncertain terms that I did not wish to express this sort of thing. And no, I do not believe you are harmful to her in whole, only that you are more harmful than myself. How much you /help/ her is another question entirely."

    "But do not claim you have respected my efforts. You went into this believing that I was nothing but harm to her, have repeatedly made it clear that you were paying no attention to my sustained effort to help her, and have made it rather obvious through this entire discussion that your primary concern is the protection of Lady Fairchild from undue harm and the respect of your own efforts, both of which I have attempted to indulge to the best of my abilities."

    "My view of you became as it is the very moment when you tried to believe that you have the same perspective as I do. I am not disconnecting with the racial pronoun, angel. Believe me, I am connecting, vicariously. Your half of humanity does not qualify you to claim you know what this situation is like for me." A familiar bit of phrasing comes up. "There is a very severe mitigating factor."

Psyber (253) has posed:
    Psyber holds up a finger to Nathan because he needs a second on J-IC.

    Then Psyber takes a slow and deep breath, staring across the table at Nathan, "No, Nathan. I'd rather you not suffer. But at the same time, I think I am well within my right to express concern for the path I worry you might be on," He says in a serious tone, staring Nathan dead on.

    "Look, I have the opinions I do. They're not yours, but you're right. I locked into my opinion so hard that I overlooked your own efforts while still claiming to know your emotions. And I missed the forest for the trees, so to speak. By looking at the minor sleights in conversation that you delivered, I missed the broader concessions you were making to Elliana while you attempt to make ammends." Psyber admits to Nathan, leaning back in the chair, "And you have me dead to rights there, and I apologize. I can read a lot of you, but not all of you."

    Psyber then sighs a bit, "I don't have your perspective, but neither do you fully have mine. You can claim to connect vicariously in order to claim you know what my motives are. What I want from Elliana in the end of it. My perspective, but I promise you don't know what I'm thinking or feeling."

    "As much as I want to pick you up and shake you when you say it to me like you just did," Psyber says, looking across the table at Nathan, "I have mitigating factors too."

    Psyber taps the table a few more times, "But can you at least promise, if this is a problem with me, to bring it up before it reaches a boiling point like this? I don't want Elliana to be a friction point for you and me."

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    "I do not intend to abandon any friendship with you or anything like that." Nathan says, plainly, as if it were completely obvious. "And of course I do not have your perspective. I do not claim to, which is why I do not claim to understand either your motivations or your goals. As I mentioned, I avoided making judgements. The most I do is statements that are as close to objective as possible."

    He seems as calm and stoic as ever. "I connect in that I speak of the disconnect that truly exists. I do not connect to who you are." He gestures vaguely, to emphasize a lack of understanding. "I will not promise, since, as I am sure I have demonstrated today, not knowing is better than knowing. It only matters if it is beyond my ability to control, at which point you will already be well aware of it, and I have no means of judging how close such a matter is to being beyond control. So I cannot promise. I will, however, apologize for such things."

    He makes a plaintive gesture, a vaguely helpless one. "They are a flaw in my emotional control. I wish these sorts of things did not apply. I simply do what I can to address them." He's not discussed the worry Psyber might have for the path Nathan is on, for whatever reason.

Psyber (253) has posed:
    "No, man. For whatever argument we had today, I'm glad we had this talk. It gave me some perspective on you and made me realize some things," Psyber says, somewhat internally glad that this conversation is coming to a wind down, "Yeah, it was unpleasant to go through, but can you tell me you received no Carthasis from at least getting it off your chest? Or you don't really feel an accomplishment for giving me an enlightened perspective?"

    He crosses his arms over his chest, "I think with my mitigating factors, you might actually stop being my friend. Or I worry sometimes." Psyber says seriously, "I worry it might stop a lot of things, truthfully." He confesses to the librarian before he rubs the back of his head.

    "Look dude, I'd rather know than not, especially if I can fix it. And I'd rather our relationship have no actual issues than not, because if we're keeping shit from eachother, I dunno. How can we trust one another if we can't tell eachother anything?"

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    "I do not." Nathan says, simply. "Speaking much of my heinous flaws in emotional control is something I do not find enjoyable in any capacity, so I find little emotional gratification." He says this as calmly and casually as you'd read a story out of a book. "Nor do I feel much accomplishment. As I mentioned, I had my objections to your opinions under control, and what I feel is irrelevant while it does not affect my actions."

    He leans back in a more relaxed posture. "I have no intention of abandoning friendship, as I said. There is no adequate cause and no benefit for doing so. What strength does a friendship have if it cannot withstand the stress of a single disagreement?" He shrugs vaguely. "As I said, it is miserable to know, and to tell, so I did not. Since my objections to your opinion were not affecting my decisions before, easing them has no advantage. And I have a natural disposition to avoid such discussion. Some things are best left unsaid, even among friends." He leans forward and gestures with one hand.

    "Trust is not telling someone everything. Trust is knowing that things are left unsaid because it was honestly believed to be for the best."

    Another plaintive, open-palmed gesture at himself. "I hardly expect you to simply gush every feeling you have at me, and hold no offense about any harmless secrets that do not affect your decisionmaking. Regardless, I trust you completely to do what you say, and what is right in the way that I traditionally understand you perceive it."

Psyber (253) has posed:
    "Nathan, what happened in your past?" Psyber asks seriously, looking at Nathan in a curious manner, "I mean, no offense. What happened that caused you to bottle up your feelings and wall them off from others? This predates anything you've experienced in the Multiverse, because this a callous someone builds over a lifetime."

    "I like to think I know you, and can read you. But you deny yourself simple things and wall off your emotions from people around you," He says, not really sure what to make of that response, "I mean, to this extent. It's not that I think you can't feel them, but are you scared to let them out or something? What happened there, man? Someone should normally feel a sense of catharsis for expressing their grievances and relief that they brought understanding to a friend and shifted his viewpoints."

    "It's not that I think you don't feel them, but I guess I just don't get what could cause someone to view it like that."

    Psyber reaches for his pad and tears off a page. Instead of water, a bottle of scotch and two glasses appears. The half-angel pours some into each glass and slides it to Nathan, "Bro code. Now we drink, by the way."

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    "Nothing worth speaking of." Nathan says, making a dismissing sort of gesture. "Old, petty shames I would rather not put on display, and certainly nothing as dramatic as you make it sound. This is no trauma response, merely a rational decision made shortly after a lesson I was taught. Suffice to say it made me disinterested in baring my emotions, even to close friends."

    He looks at the scotch that was sent his way. "This never turns out well, you know." He says, plainly, holding the glass up like he would a large spider. "Not in the 'shenanigans' way, I mean that it makes for unpleasant discussion. But yes, you are correct. I certainly feel emotion. I have simply made the decision to ignore it in decisionmaking circumstances."

Psyber (253) has posed:
    "I find the opposite," Psyber says, picking up his glass and downing a good part of it in one go and then pouring himself some more, "I didn't pour you a lot and I won't make you drink any more. It's a ceremonial thing for me. You bond over alcohol after an argument."

    Psyber spins the glass, "I guess you not wanting to speak about your past answers my personal question of why you never asked about mine. I always thought you'd be curious about my outcastedness, why I'm around instead of higherplanes and all," He laughs a bit and then sips, "Anyway, good talk, even if you disagree."

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    "People are not books, after all." Nathan says, taking a sip despite his aversion. "You will tell me anything I need to know, or that you want me to know. Anything more, I am better left not prying into. As I said before, trust is not being told everything. Trust is knowing that not being told everything is fine." Another quick sip to punctuate. "It is good, at least, that you find the experience to have been acceptable."

Psyber (253) has posed:
    Psyber takes a sip from his drink and says to Nathan, "True, it is. Did you ever think that might be where you and she have the big difference?" He asks, "You can trust. You can put faith in me or... whoever else to come through for you. But she can't, so she needs to control everything?" It's some idle conjecture on his part as he adds, "If you wanna know my past, I'll tell you. It ties into why I hate that you call my humanity into question."

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    "It may be. I certainly would not bet on it being otherwise. What taught me to keep my emotions in check, bound to specific constraints and parameters, is the same thing that impressed upon my younger self the truth of what you say." Nathan says, trying to negotiate his way through another sip. He's just averse to the idea of drinking itself, apparently. "That, without a doubt, one can always expect a friend to come through for you, in your best interests and with surprising degrees of strength. But I like to generally believe that Lady Fairchild and I are rather dissimilar, with the exception of some overlap in our skills."

Psyber (253) has posed:
    "Perhaps you are right," Psyber says to Nathan, relenting the point and not wanting to pursue their similarities, "I just was thinking that your differences may largely arise from a moment like that. Something very early in life, you know?" He says. Psyber, unlike Nathan, drinks constantly and so has little problem with his own drink, "Truth is, I exiled myself. The way it all used to operate was so indifferent to the struggle humans have in their lives. Much too focused on the heaven versus hell area, humans were just... there. I couldn't abide it, felt like humanity deserved some protection." He points to his back vaguely, where his wings would be if he had them out, "That was how I lost the wings the first time. Not supposed to keep em on exile, they rip em out. Like how a cop turns in their badge, ID and gun. I turned in the halo, flaming sword and wings." Knowing Psyber, this could be true and it could also be a false past, since he tells those every once in a while as embellished tales. It's LIKELY true, though.

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    Nathan makes a heavy sort of acknowledging noise. "Mmmm. I can certainly understand your aversion to my more judgemental approach regarding the particular topic of your empathy with humanity." He says, at least trying to be understanding here. "The, ah... The employment-related amputations sound unpleasant." He says, hastily taking another sip, thinking it's better to have an excuse for him to pause than it is to not be drinking right now.

    "Mmnh. Right, well, as I said before, I... Try to make an effort to avoid speaking judgements on matters such as that specific sort of thing, except when it is brought up by others in the course of natural conversation. Rest assured I have no intention of grinding the point in, in any capacity." He's not going to rescind his opinion, it's clear, but he does seem at least a little uncomfortable about exposing Psyber to it much.

Psyber (253) has posed:
    "It is what it is," Psyber says in regards to his amputations, "Is it weird chicks seem to dig the scars more than the wings themselves? I feel like that's a weird testament to psychology. I never got that one," Psyber says, not seeming to particularly mind that avenue of conversation.

    "Aaah, but whatever," Psyber says, waving a hand at Nathan, "We've been at this for hours. I'll let you to your work around the library and call it a night."

Nathan Hall (168) has posed:
    "It is very weird, yes. I understand a great many things about the psychologies, the predilections and inclinations of other people when they act in a diplomatic, violent, or crisis-response capacity. Their behavior vis-a-vis attraction is an unbreakable cypher and I find it impossible to fathom."

    There's a brief, respectful nod. "I hope the conversation was acceptable. Feel free to consult me as such whenever you like, I consider myself available for such matters in as much capacity as such things are tolerated by others."